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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2021 9:55:18 GMT -6
Also increased travel and expenses is no big deal according to clemensbuff. You need to stop talking. It's actually comical as hell that you of all people on this forum are against doing something that would make it more fair to many schools since you whine more than anyone else about such things. Especially pointing towards the 'more cost' part of the equation. lol Not as comical as you talking trash and down to me when I point out the ignorance of your math but then turn around and ignore the fact that rtxc1 just shut you up with the exact same points. You go boy. lol.
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Post by BandidoNB on Jul 23, 2021 11:11:10 GMT -6
I counted 1136 2A-6A schools. That's an average of 227 schools per conference. With 7A, that number goes down to 189. There aren't enough schools to make it work. There's just too much of a disparity in 4A enrollments that is only increasing. That is what makes everything so difficult. Remember, less schools per conference means increased travel, which is why people don't like split divisions now. My thought was having the top 100 largest schools in 7A, which would leave 1036 schools between 2A - 6A. It might work. Not that I’m a proponent for 7A. But just food for thought. Especially since it’s coming in a few years.
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Post by rtxc1 on Jul 23, 2021 11:47:36 GMT -6
I counted 1136 2A-6A schools. That's an average of 227 schools per conference. With 7A, that number goes down to 189. There aren't enough schools to make it work. There's just too much of a disparity in 4A enrollments that is only increasing. That is what makes everything so difficult. Remember, less schools per conference means increased travel, which is why people don't like split divisions now. My thought was having the top 100 largest schools in 7A, which would leave 1036 schools between 2A - 6A. It might work. Not that I’m a proponent for 7A. But just food for thought. Especially since it’s coming in a few years. IMO the smallest conference needs to be 4A due to the huge enrollment gaps (currently 515-1229, 2.39x as much on the high end as low end). So using 2020 snapshots, I have 120 schools between 500 and 840. Then, I have 121 schools between 840 and 1450. That leaves 474 schools for 6A and 7A to split, so 237 schools from 1450-2300, and 237 from 2300+. That would be much more manageable, but increased travel would be present in the new 4A and 5A for non-football.
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Post by Clemensbuff on Jul 23, 2021 12:12:46 GMT -6
It's actually comical as hell that you of all people on this forum are against doing something that would make it more fair to many schools since you whine more than anyone else about such things. Especially pointing towards the 'more cost' part of the equation. lol Not as comical as you talking trash and down to me when I point out the ignorance of your math but then turn around and ignore the fact that rtxc1 just shut you up with the exact same points. You go boy. lol. who hurt your wittle feelins today. roflmao you can both have your opinion all you want and i respect it. But, the bottom line is when it comes to kids I don't give two chits what the cost is when it comes to doing what is in their best interest and to me parity is in their best interest. I could only imagine the whining we'd hear outta you if your team (Miller now) would be matched up against a team deep in the playoffs that was 100% are even more size wise with enrollment.
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Post by Clemensbuff on Jul 23, 2021 12:16:12 GMT -6
My thought was having the top 100 largest schools in 7A, which would leave 1036 schools between 2A - 6A. It might work. Not that I’m a proponent for 7A. But just food for thought. Especially since it’s coming in a few years. IMO the smallest conference needs to be 4A due to the huge enrollment gaps (currently 515-1229, 2.39x as much on the high end as low end). So using 2020 snapshots, I have 120 schools between 500 and 840. Then, I have 121 schools between 840 and 1450. That leaves 474 schools for 6A and 7A to split, so 237 schools from 1450-2300, and 237 from 2300+. That would be much more manageable, but increased travel would be present in the new 4A and 5A for non-football. I agree with you with the 4a issue 100%. Now go look and see what the disparity can be in a 6a matchup and you will find it is very possible a team with 2300 kids could match up with one over 5000. So, how would what BandidoNB is talking about not help all the way down the line from 6a to 2a? There is no doubt building an additional classification will cause more travel for many of the schools. So what. Pony up and pay the piper......it's for the kids! My taxes on a 1800sf home & 1 acre are absolutely ridiculous already but if it cost me another $100/year show me where to send the check!
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Post by rtxc1 on Jul 23, 2021 12:51:09 GMT -6
IMO the smallest conference needs to be 4A due to the huge enrollment gaps (currently 515-1229, 2.39x as much on the high end as low end). So using 2020 snapshots, I have 120 schools between 500 and 840. Then, I have 121 schools between 840 and 1450. That leaves 474 schools for 6A and 7A to split, so 237 schools from 1450-2300, and 237 from 2300+. That would be much more manageable, but increased travel would be present in the new 4A and 5A for non-football. I agree with you with the 4a issue 100%. Now go look and see what the disparity can be in a 6a matchup and you will find it is very possible a team with 2300 kids could match up with one over 5000. So, how would what BandidoNB is talking about not help all the way down the line from 6a to 2a? There is no doubt building an additional classification will cause more travel for many of the schools. So what. Pony up and pay the piper......it's for the kids! My taxes on a 1800sf home & 1 acre are absolutely ridiculous already but if it cost me another $100/year show me where to send the check! The difference doesn't really matter much when schools are that big. Also, if you take the top 100, that's 2900+. Keep in mind, though, that the bigger school districts probably won't like having their schools split up - that's why they won't approve a division split. So if they don't like it currently, why would they want to do so just to create a 7A? 7A - 100 schools - 2901+ 6A - 241 schools - 2001-2900 5A - 216 schools - 1001-2000 4A - 149 schools - 501-1000 See the issue? To fix it, look below: 7A - 100 schools - 2901+ 6A - 213 schools - 2071-2900 5A - 200 schools - 1151-2070 4A - 200 schools - 501-1150 It could work, but you are basically making it easier for the big schools to win a title, but not doing much for the school who has 501 students. Basically - 4A is where the main issue lies (UIL has said as much), and it is debatable on whether or not the enrollment gap affects much in 6A.
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Post by Clemensbuff on Jul 23, 2021 13:37:08 GMT -6
I agree with you with the 4a issue 100%. Now go look and see what the disparity can be in a 6a matchup and you will find it is very possible a team with 2300 kids could match up with one over 5000. So, how would what BandidoNB is talking about not help all the way down the line from 6a to 2a? There is no doubt building an additional classification will cause more travel for many of the schools. So what. Pony up and pay the piper......it's for the kids! My taxes on a 1800sf home & 1 acre are absolutely ridiculous already but if it cost me another $100/year show me where to send the check! The difference doesn't really matter much when schools are that big. Also, if you take the top 100, that's 2900+. Keep in mind, though, that the bigger school districts probably won't like having their schools split up - that's why they won't approve a division split. So if they don't like it currently, why would they want to do so just to create a 7A? 7A - 100 schools - 2901+ 6A - 241 schools - 2001-2900 5A - 216 schools - 1001-2000 4A - 149 schools - 501-1000 See the issue? To fix it, look below: 7A - 100 schools - 2901+ 6A - 213 schools - 2071-2900 5A - 200 schools - 1151-2070 4A - 200 schools - 501-1150 It could work, but you are basically making it easier for the big schools to win a title, but not doing much for the school who has 501 students. Basically - 4A is where the main issue lies (UIL has said as much), and it is debatable on whether or not the enrollment gap affects much in 6A. I completely disagree with you on the enlarged sentence above. We played Katy 3 times in the semis in 4 seasons and at that time we had about 2200 kids and they were about 3400. How is that any difference that not a big disadvantage? When we played DeSoto in the finals we were still under 2,300 and they were way over 3k. And now, not that it matters much because our program is a shadow of what it was then, we are D1 with only 2600 kids. Take a look at what a bunch of the Houston and DFW 6a D1 numbers are!
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Post by leopard4life on Jul 23, 2021 22:15:13 GMT -6
I feel that High schools should be limited on the enrolment. Some Texas big city schools (Allen) need to be much smaller. There are a lot of academic, vocational, and economic advantage to Allen’s model.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2021 5:06:09 GMT -6
I feel that High schools should be limited on the enrolment. Some Texas big city schools (Allen) need to be much smaller. There are a lot of academic, vocational, and economic advantage to Allen’s model. There's jack chit advantage to having 7k enrollment other than the advantage created for you in sports. And that advantage is, "winning", not something for the kids sake.
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Post by leopard4life on Jul 24, 2021 12:10:53 GMT -6
There are a lot of academic, vocational, and economic advantage to Allen’s model. There's jack chit advantage to having 7k enrollment other than the advantage created for you in sports. And that advantage is, "winning", not something for the kids sake. Allen has more courses offered than pretty much every school in Texas, they have an on campus IB program, lower admin over head, nicer/newer/fewer facilities than similar sized programs, and that's just naming a few advantages. Allen can offer courses and full programs that other schools cannot because they have enough students to take the classes. They have on campus college courses and certification programs, along with on campus vocational programs. I've lives next to Allen ISD for over 20 years, I just wanted a smaller environment for my kids.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2021 12:22:40 GMT -6
There's jack chit advantage to having 7k enrollment other than the advantage created for you in sports. And that advantage is, "winning", not something for the kids sake. Allen has more courses offered than pretty much every school in Texas, they have an on campus IB program, lower admin over head, nicer/newer/fewer facilities than similar sized programs, and that's just naming a few advantages. Allen can offer courses and full programs that other schools cannot because they have enough students to take the classes. They have on campus college courses and certification programs, along with on campus vocational programs. I've lives next to Allen ISD for over 20 years, I just wanted a smaller environment for my kids. They have all that because they are a rich area not because of the enrollment numbers. And guess what would happen if they split up into 2 schools... they'd still have all that... at 2 schools. Go tell some Valley schools that all that matters is enrollment numbers. It's not.
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Post by leopard4life on Jul 24, 2021 14:07:58 GMT -6
Allen has more courses offered than pretty much every school in Texas, they have an on campus IB program, lower admin over head, nicer/newer/fewer facilities than similar sized programs, and that's just naming a few advantages. Allen can offer courses and full programs that other schools cannot because they have enough students to take the classes. They have on campus college courses and certification programs, along with on campus vocational programs. I've lives next to Allen ISD for over 20 years, I just wanted a smaller environment for my kids. They have all that because they are a rich area not because of the enrollment numbers. And guess what would happen if they split up into 2 schools... they'd still have all that... at 2 schools. Go tell some Valley schools that all that matters is enrollment numbers. It's not. Valley schools are some of the highest per student districts in the state. abc13.com/texas-water-park-school-la-joya-isd-funding/4162905/Allen isn't rich, depending on what you qualify as rich.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2021 16:19:38 GMT -6
They have all that because they are a rich area not because of the enrollment numbers. And guess what would happen if they split up into 2 schools... they'd still have all that... at 2 schools. Go tell some Valley schools that all that matters is enrollment numbers. It's not. Valley schools are some of the highest per student districts in the state. abc13.com/texas-water-park-school-la-joya-isd-funding/4162905/Allen isn't rich, depending on what you qualify as rich. Affording a $70 million stadium seems rich to me lol.
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Post by rtxc1 on Jul 25, 2021 8:03:32 GMT -6
The difference doesn't really matter much when schools are that big. Also, if you take the top 100, that's 2900+. Keep in mind, though, that the bigger school districts probably won't like having their schools split up - that's why they won't approve a division split. So if they don't like it currently, why would they want to do so just to create a 7A? 7A - 100 schools - 2901+ 6A - 241 schools - 2001-2900 5A - 216 schools - 1001-2000 4A - 149 schools - 501-1000 See the issue? To fix it, look below: 7A - 100 schools - 2901+ 6A - 213 schools - 2071-2900 5A - 200 schools - 1151-2070 4A - 200 schools - 501-1150 It could work, but you are basically making it easier for the big schools to win a title, but not doing much for the school who has 501 students. Basically - 4A is where the main issue lies (UIL has said as much), and it is debatable on whether or not the enrollment gap affects much in 6A. I completely disagree with you on the enlarged sentence above. We played Katy 3 times in the semis in 4 seasons and at that time we had about 2200 kids and they were about 3400. How is that any difference that not a big disadvantage? When we played DeSoto in the finals we were still under 2,300 and they were way over 3k. And now, not that it matters much because our program is a shadow of what it was then, we are D1 with only 2600 kids. Take a look at what a bunch of the Houston and DFW 6a D1 numbers are! Well, the UIL's mission is to take the top 250 schools as 6A, then keep a 2:1 ratio in all of the other classifications. UIL doesn't currently care about the ratio in 6A, but even if they did, it would be 2:1, and your matchup was firmly inside that. It's also something that could be fixed by a divisional split, if 6A would just get on board with it. So you would rather give the largest 100 schools an even easier path to championships in non-football sports than direct the help where help is truly needed (4A)?
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Post by rtxc1 on Jul 25, 2021 8:07:13 GMT -6
Affording a $70 million stadium seems rich to me lol. Denison is pretty poor, but we could afford one if the taxpayers were stupid enough to pass the bond.
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