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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 7:58:18 GMT -6
Yep. I thought Houston bought artificial turf to roll out at Reliant for events like this? What happened with that? Somebody needs to give the UIL a clue. While I think everyone gets that Cowgirl Stadium is a fantastic and one of a kind venue, it is NOT geographically friendly to the rest of the state. And it is very expensive to watch a game there. While the 4A and 5A title games are more often dominated with teams from more of the wealthier burbs from the large metro area. When you get down to 3A and below, most of these teams are not from The Woodlands, Southlake, Katy, etc. They are largely rural and far away from the DFW area. Most of those folks don't have high paying jobs and just think what it cost them individually and the school district for a minimum two days up there. Oh, and all of this during Christmas too. All while the good folks at Southlake or Allen get to stay home, sleep in their beds and just bus over to Jerryworld. Yeah, having all the state title games at Jerry World is great for casual fans who just want to catch three games in one day (as I did last year) but I can see the arguments against. At the same time, complaining about travel for the smaller schools? Eh, if you're in the state title game you're going to have to travel no matter what. If East Bernard plays, I don't know, Canadian in the state championship game, there's no way around traveling long distances for both teams as you'd be talking about a team from the Panhandle playing a team from fringe metro Houston. Tennessee has done the central-site state championship games for as long as I can remember and nobody really complains about it (even though it's a short trip for the teams in Nashville but not for the rest of the state)... I don't know why the UIL doesn't just use DKR or something more centrally located though. I understand the travel component would be there for many schools regardless of the venue. Away from cost to and from, Jerryworld is just to dang expensive. Using Canadian as example or any West Texas school or South Texas school for that matter, why should the DFW schools get a short trip to the venue on what is now an annual basis while others have to spend huge $$$ to travel. If Canadian has to travel, make ------- from the DFW area travel as well at least once every three years. BTW, Tenneessee is much smaller than Texas. Comparing the two is not valid.
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Post by Tom on Aug 21, 2013 8:07:16 GMT -6
THIS. In Tennessee, there was also no such thing as indoor football. Same in Kentucky when I was stationed at Fort Campbell, KY (split by Kentucky & Tennessee State Lines). Kentucky does the same and no indoor facilities. Kentucky allows the Private Schools to play in the Public Schools Athletics. So that recruiting battle goes on. TN is similar; the private schools have their own division, but it's all under the same governing body, and some private schools are allowed to play in the public school division if they don't offer financial aid.
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Post by Tom on Aug 21, 2013 8:11:39 GMT -6
Yeah, having all the state title games at Jerry World is great for casual fans who just want to catch three games in one day (as I did last year) but I can see the arguments against. At the same time, complaining about travel for the smaller schools? Eh, if you're in the state title game you're going to have to travel no matter what. If East Bernard plays, I don't know, Canadian in the state championship game, there's no way around traveling long distances for both teams as you'd be talking about a team from the Panhandle playing a team from fringe metro Houston. Tennessee has done the central-site state championship games for as long as I can remember and nobody really complains about it (even though it's a short trip for the teams in Nashville but not for the rest of the state)... I don't know why the UIL doesn't just use DKR or something more centrally located though. I understand the travel component would be there for many schools regardless of the venue. Away from cost to and from, Jerryworld is just to dang expensive. Using Canadian as example or any West Texas school or South Texas school for that matter, why should the DFW schools get a short trip to the venue on what is now an annual basis while others have to spend huge $$$ to travel. If Canadian has to travel, make ------- from the DFW area travel as well at least once every three years. BTW, Tenneessee is much smaller than Texas. Comparing the two is not valid. What's the expense difference? I get that tickets and concessions are more expensive, but other than that, what's the difference between having an East Bernard or Refugio go to Jerry World vs. going to, say, Waco? I went to a playoff game at UNT back in 2011 and tickets were $10. Concessions, while not Jerry World expensive, were still more expensive than what you'd usually see at a high school game.
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Post by CC_Varmints on Aug 21, 2013 8:23:19 GMT -6
I understand the travel component would be there for many schools regardless of the venue. Away from cost to and from, Jerryworld is just to dang expensive. Using Canadian as example or any West Texas school or South Texas school for that matter, why should the DFW schools get a short trip to the venue on what is now an annual basis while others have to spend huge $$$ to travel. If Canadian has to travel, make ------- from the DFW area travel as well at least once every three years. BTW, Tenneessee is much smaller than Texas. Comparing the two is not valid. What's the expense difference? I get that tickets and concessions are more expensive, but other than that, what's the difference between having an East Bernard or Refugio go to Jerry World vs. going to, say, Waco? I went to a playoff game at UNT back in 2011 and tickets were $10. Concessions, while not Jerry World expensive, were still more expensive than what you'd usually see at a high school game. The gas expense to DFW is way more than to Austin or San Antonio or Houston. Plus having to get a hotel for 1 or 2 nights. The DFW fans just go back home. It would be nice if the DFW fans had to share in that expense experience on a rotating basis and not just the far outlying fans every year.
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Post by warcat82 on Aug 21, 2013 8:27:38 GMT -6
I understand the travel component would be there for many schools regardless of the venue. Away from cost to and from, Jerryworld is just to dang expensive. Using Canadian as example or any West Texas school or South Texas school for that matter, why should the DFW schools get a short trip to the venue on what is now an annual basis while others have to spend huge $$$ to travel. If Canadian has to travel, make ------- from the DFW area travel as well at least once every three years. BTW, Tenneessee is much smaller than Texas. Comparing the two is not valid. What's the expense difference? I get that tickets and concessions are more expensive, but other than that, what's the difference between having an East Bernard or Refugio go to Jerry World vs. going to, say, Waco? I went to a playoff game at UNT back in 2011 and tickets were $10. Concessions, while not Jerry World expensive, were still more expensive than what you'd usually see at a high school game. Ok corpus is 7 1/2 hours from Dallas roughly... The valley about 10 hours away... So you figure at $3.50 a gallon for gas that's probably an addition $200 at least per car load traveling each way... Plus $70-$120 or more per hotel room for at least 1 night plus food even at whataburger $10 a person a meal. Add to it the longer the travel the more worn out the kids are, even going up a day or two early sleeping in a hotel compared to home is not the same... If you take a charter bus now your paying a bus driver to sleep in a hotel plus a bus ticket, for the schools mileage is factored into the budget for that sport so you're paying the bus driver from the time they leave to the time the return, including sleeping... Schools could be out over $3000 in expenses and per fan could be out over $1000
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Post by Tom on Aug 21, 2013 8:50:44 GMT -6
What's the expense difference? I get that tickets and concessions are more expensive, but other than that, what's the difference between having an East Bernard or Refugio go to Jerry World vs. going to, say, Waco? I went to a playoff game at UNT back in 2011 and tickets were $10. Concessions, while not Jerry World expensive, were still more expensive than what you'd usually see at a high school game. Ok corpus is 7 1/2 hours from Dallas roughly... The valley about 10 hours away... So you figure at $3.50 a gallon for gas that's probably an addition $200 at least per car load traveling each way... Plus $70-$120 or more per hotel room for at least 1 night plus food even at whataburger $10 a person a meal. Add to it the longer the travel the more worn out the kids are, even going up a day or two early sleeping in a hotel compared to home is not the same... If you take a charter bus now your paying a bus driver to sleep in a hotel plus a bus ticket, for the schools mileage is factored into the budget for that sport so you're paying the bus driver from the time they leave to the time the return, including sleeping... Schools could be out over $3000 in expenses and per fan could be out over $1000 I understand that you guys are pretty South Texas-centric, but let's look at this from another perspective. Let's take Stratford, which is similarly situated in that they're in a far corner of the state, but unlike anybody in the Valley they've actually played for a state championship in recent years. For them to get to Arlington, that's a 6.5-7 hour trip. Sound bad? Well, from there, San Antonio's a nine-hour trip and Houston is ten hours. So... moving the state championship to San Antonio or Houston is great for the Coastal Bend and the Valley, but it's brutal for anyone from the Panhandle. There's no good way to do this.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 9:05:36 GMT -6
Ok corpus is 7 1/2 hours from Dallas roughly... The valley about 10 hours away... So you figure at $3.50 a gallon for gas that's probably an addition $200 at least per car load traveling each way... Plus $70-$120 or more per hotel room for at least 1 night plus food even at whataburger $10 a person a meal. Add to it the longer the travel the more worn out the kids are, even going up a day or two early sleeping in a hotel compared to home is not the same... If you take a charter bus now your paying a bus driver to sleep in a hotel plus a bus ticket, for the schools mileage is factored into the budget for that sport so you're paying the bus driver from the time they leave to the time the return, including sleeping... Schools could be out over $3000 in expenses and per fan could be out over $1000 I understand that you guys are pretty South Texas-centric, but let's look at this from another perspective. Let's take Stratford, which is similarly situated in that they're in a far corner of the state, but unlike anybody in the Valley they've actually played for a state championship in recent years. For them to get to Arlington, that's a 6.5-7 hour trip. Sound bad? Well, from there, San Antonio's a nine-hour trip and Houston is ten hours. So... moving the state championship to San Antonio or Houston is great for the Coastal Bend and the Valley, but it's brutal for anyone from the Panhandle. There's no good way to do this. I guess Tom is correct and we should just keep everything in the DFW area? Let's just move the baseball, basketball, and track and field there as well.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 9:10:28 GMT -6
What's the expense difference? I get that tickets and concessions are more expensive, but other than that, what's the difference between having an East Bernard or Refugio go to Jerry World vs. going to, say, Waco? I went to a playoff game at UNT back in 2011 and tickets were $10. Concessions, while not Jerry World expensive, were still more expensive than what you'd usually see at a high school game. Ok corpus is 7 1/2 hours from Dallas roughly... The valley about 10 hours away... So you figure at $3.50 a gallon for gas that's probably an addition $200 at least per car load traveling each way... Plus $70-$120 or more per hotel room for at least 1 night plus food even at whataburger $10 a person a meal. Add to it the longer the travel the more worn out the kids are, even going up a day or two early sleeping in a hotel compared to home is not the same... If you take a charter bus now your paying a bus driver to sleep in a hotel plus a bus ticket, for the schools mileage is factored into the budget for that sport so you're paying the bus driver from the time they leave to the time the return, including sleeping... Schools could be out over $3000 in expenses and per fan could be out over $1000 We had the same thing on a Regional level in 4A and 5A here in Region IV for decades it seems where every Regional event was in San Antonio. Finally the RGV and Coastal Bend Superintendents and AD's spoke up and the UIL made a change where the RGV and Coastal Bend started hosting some of these regionals. It was short of criminal, IMO in events like Track and Field where you had the San Antonio area schools being able to stay close to home and a kid from Brownsville had to travel 4 1/2 hours to run his event.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 9:14:34 GMT -6
Ok corpus is 7 1/2 hours from Dallas roughly... The valley about 10 hours away... So you figure at $3.50 a gallon for gas that's probably an addition $200 at least per car load traveling each way... Plus $70-$120 or more per hotel room for at least 1 night plus food even at whataburger $10 a person a meal. Add to it the longer the travel the more worn out the kids are, even going up a day or two early sleeping in a hotel compared to home is not the same... If you take a charter bus now your paying a bus driver to sleep in a hotel plus a bus ticket, for the schools mileage is factored into the budget for that sport so you're paying the bus driver from the time they leave to the time the return, including sleeping... Schools could be out over $3000 in expenses and per fan could be out over $1000 I understand that you guys are pretty South Texas-centric, but let's look at this from another perspective. Let's take Stratford, which is similarly situated in that they're in a far corner of the state, but unlike anybody in the Valley they've actually played for a state championship in recent years. For them to get to Arlington, that's a 6.5-7 hour trip. Sound bad? Well, from there, San Antonio's a nine-hour trip and Houston is ten hours. So... moving the state championship to San Antonio or Houston is great for the Coastal Bend and the Valley, but it's brutal for anyone from the Panhandle. There's no good way to do this. BTW Tom, I'm not saying do this on a permanent basis. Just rotate the damn thing. Why should you all in the Metroplex be exempt from having to pay for travel and the such while the rest of the state has to pay for it year and year out ? Seems like you want to avoid that question.
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Post by Tom on Aug 21, 2013 9:21:44 GMT -6
I understand that you guys are pretty South Texas-centric, but let's look at this from another perspective. Let's take Stratford, which is similarly situated in that they're in a far corner of the state, but unlike anybody in the Valley they've actually played for a state championship in recent years. For them to get to Arlington, that's a 6.5-7 hour trip. Sound bad? Well, from there, San Antonio's a nine-hour trip and Houston is ten hours. So... moving the state championship to San Antonio or Houston is great for the Coastal Bend and the Valley, but it's brutal for anyone from the Panhandle. There's no good way to do this. BTW Tom, I'm not saying do this on a permanent basis. Just rotate the damn thing. Why should you all in the Metroplex be exempt from having to pay for travel and the such while the rest of the state has to pay for it year and year out ? Seems like you want to avoid that question. You must have missed the part where I moved to Houston in June. My point is that if you do a central-site state championship, regardless of where it is, you're going to have some teams that will have a long trip and some that are relatively close by. The other alternative is to go back to the system where you just have the two schools agree on a neutral site. I'm about 99 percent sure the reason that the UIL is keeping the title games at the Death Star has more to do with Jerry giving them a deal on renting the place out than anything else.
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Post by cochino on Aug 21, 2013 9:34:37 GMT -6
It's all nonsense to have it predetermined. I'm sure the corrupt morons at UIL get some nice money under the table to make this happen. It's way too far a drive if a team from down here makes it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2013 9:37:52 GMT -6
BTW Tom, I'm not saying do this on a permanent basis. Just rotate the damn thing. Why should you all in the Metroplex be exempt from having to pay for travel and the such while the rest of the state has to pay for it year and year out ? Seems like you want to avoid that question. You must have missed the part where I moved to Houston in June. My point is that if you do a central-site state championship, regardless of where it is, you're going to have some teams that will have a long trip and some that are relatively close by. The other alternative is to go back to the system where you just have the two schools agree on a neutral site. I'm about 99 percent sure the reason that the UIL is keeping the title games at the Death Star has more to do with Jerry giving them a deal on renting the place out than anything else. No doubt that is a big part. Jerry the publicity hound like to make it look like he's doing the good people of Texas a favor. And the UIL willingly slurps it up like a thirsty dog goes after a bowl of water. And at the end of the day, the UIL has lost it's focus. The folks in the DFW area don't see that, but if they had to travel back to back to back to San Antonio or Houston, I can almost be certain they would be speaking a different tune. I don't care if they were from Highland Park or South Oak Cliff, money is money. At the very least, the UIL should supplement some of the travel cost for schools that have to travel from a four hour radius from the DFW area. If the Einsteins at the UIL decide to do a Houston or San Antonio all class championship, do the same for schools out a certain radius from those area. That's if the UIL is truly making money off this with the sweet deal on the venues and the Fox Sports TV contract.
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Post by Tom on Aug 21, 2013 9:47:58 GMT -6
You must have missed the part where I moved to Houston in June. My point is that if you do a central-site state championship, regardless of where it is, you're going to have some teams that will have a long trip and some that are relatively close by. The other alternative is to go back to the system where you just have the two schools agree on a neutral site. I'm about 99 percent sure the reason that the UIL is keeping the title games at the Death Star has more to do with Jerry giving them a deal on renting the place out than anything else. No doubt that is a big part. Jerry the publicity hound like to make it look like he's doing the good people of Texas a favor. And the UIL willingly slurps it up like a thirsty dog goes after a bowl of water. And at the end of the day, the UIL has lost it's focus. The folks in the DFW area don't see that, but if they had to travel back to back to back to San Antonio or Houston, I can almost be certain they would be speaking a different tune. I don't care if they were from Highland Park or South Oak Cliff, money is money. At the very least, the UIL should supplement some of the travel cost for schools that have to travel from a four hour radius from the DFW area. If the Einsteins at the UIL decide to do a Houston or San Antonio all class championship, do the same for schools out a certain radius from those area. That's if the UIL is truly making money off this with the sweet deal on the venues and the Fox Sports TV contract. Considering the attendance at $15 a pop and the Fox Sports TV contract, if they're NOT making money off this, something is clearly wrong.
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Post by Tom on Aug 21, 2013 9:52:19 GMT -6
It's all nonsense to have it predetermined. I'm sure the corrupt morons at UIL get some nice money under the table to make this happen. It's way too far a drive if a team from down here makes it. Let's get real for a minute, when was the last time a team from "down there" made it to state? In the real world, the longest trip anybody had to make for last year's state championships was El Campo's trip, which Google Maps says is 4:46.
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Post by cochino on Aug 21, 2013 10:03:51 GMT -6
It's all nonsense to have it predetermined. I'm sure the corrupt morons at UIL get some nice money under the table to make this happen. It's way too far a drive if a team from down here makes it. Let's get real for a minute, when was the last time a team from "down there" made it to state? In the real world, the longest trip anybody had to make for last year's state championships was El Campo's trip, which Google Maps says is 4:46. Nice job missing the point for the sake of making a sarcastic remark. Forrest Gump much?
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